Pretty funny post In which @292 complains about people wh…

And what does thuggishness lead to...

Mission accomplished 👍

Wrong. BSV is leaderless and permissionless. I’ve been telling people to ignore Craig and get to work for years now.

It’s not my fault that everyone just wants to sit back and hope for some guy in the UK to make them rich.

What a privileged thing to say, not everyone has time or skills to develop.
Also it is not leaderless, someone chooses the exact hard fork parameters, which is nChain. BSV is literally defined by this leader.

Again, just the same old cut & paste response. Doesn't address any real concerns, just manufactures and then boorishly dismisses a spurious argument.

💤

This is also untrue. Miners choose the parameters to run. If there's any leader in BSV, I'd argue that it's TAAL or Mempool.

And you don't need to be a developer to get to work. I don't write any commercial code for BSV. How about biz dev? Sales?

Kurt is an alpha chad.

However the reason most BSV speculators focus in BSV/USD is because BSV has failed in terms of BTC/BSV.

Creg has repeatedly stated that miners do NOT choose the rules, they merely enforce them. They can choose parameters which are within the rules dictated by nChain. You’re thinking of BTC and BCH.

The concern is a false premise. The solution is actually to dilute the influence any of any one person by becoming more valuable yourself.

If you have a better idea, I'm all ears.

You can’t dilute the influence of someone who has legal monopoly over defining what is the correct way and fights people who disagree. The wiser choice unfortunately is to simply exit and let the system eat itself.

Miners still choose what they run. They choose to run the BSV reference client. Seems Unbounded will choose to run Xoken Vega this year too.

And you're conflating separate things here. Miners don't choose to change rules. They can enforce or leave.

Yes, so your choice is to submit as a beta under the assumption that Creg is the alpha. So, we seem to agree about that, to a degree. However, I don't submit to anything I disagree with, and I intend to create more value on/with BSV than anyone else.

Yes, exit the system.

Keep in mind though this system wants to eat all the other ones, not itself.

That's quite the paradox. Bitcoin will subsume all but first it needs to be abandoned by all

The whole thing is silly. Anyone's influence can be diluted. It's a proof of work system.

The concern here is thuggish behavior from BSV influencers.

And obviously I'm actually employing your recommended solution.

im referring to the anti hodl sentiment.

You and I are old timers. this was never the case 🤔

Lets see if the mass exodus exiting positions will improve things 🤷‍♂️

if hodling bsv is a bet on csw's success

and his plan to destroy LN(and thus flippen on fundamentals)has shifted to legislative action

then hodling BSV is a speculative investment in CSW's success in court

that is a much shittier bet than hodling a meme

I'm not being thuggish. I *want* you to do incredible things. I want you to feel encouraged & empowered. If you love bitcoin, and hate the way that anyone else behaves, you need to rise and do something more valuable to teach them.

That's what I'm doing.

But only proof of work can solve this. Sybil attacks beget more sybil attacks.

I'm not anti-hodl. I'm anti exclusive hodl. There's more money to be made by generating value than absorbing value.

Absorption is proof of stake, and it's working famously when big stakers like Saylor pump BTC. But that doesn't indicate their victory.

it always does. these hands dropping the bags now would be the first to exit later, and dampen that rise.

sell your bsv folks.

do u like court? bsv is court coin

At some point (I don't know when), whoever invested the most in systems which create value will win the whole game. HODLers will benefit too, but if nobody is doing business dev, then we're all screwed. And I'm not relying on CSW to do my biz dev for me...

As an aside, this whole redefinition of PoW and PoS is bizzare. I get it, but it’s a forced analogy and the kind of language game that makes you check for spooks.

maybe 'Absorption is rent-seeking behavior' would have been better

PoW and PoS in consensus networks are both based on old world economic principles. They don't exist in a vacuum. They apply to consensus, because they describe actual human behavior in regards to the creation and absorption of wealth and influence.

I’m glad we agree miners don’t choose the rules. nChain has and does.
If Xoken and nChain ran different rules, which one would keep the name BSV? How exactly would that get resolved? Not by hash power, as we’ve seen.

Deep stuff!!! 🎓👍

The use of the whole alpha/beta thing is thuggish. An attempt to belittle your critics.

I would think a real alpha, if there were such a thing, wouldn't need to verbalize it.

Bitcoin is an unchanging principle. If you think it is defined by software written by nChain employees, then we're going to need to start this conversation a lot further back than discussing hash rate and consensus.

an understanding to these principles leads to an understanding of the oligarchic outcome of proof of stake

I'm not putting the criticism on anyone. I'm saying that to be a certain way is beta, and that we should all seek to be alphas. Again, this is a proof of work system, just like a wolf pack.

I didn't call out anyone by name. I'm offering a challenge.

Is BTC absorbing fiat value bad or good? moral or immoral?

It's none of those things. It is fleeting, though, and as soon as there isn't more value to be absorbed, it will begin purging that value until it hits its utilitarian floor. There is some value in everything. It gets discovered when we're all hungry.

BTC *is* a fiat

it empowers those who have the most of it, so whether the result is good or bad perhaps depends on the results of the actions manifested in the world from expending that value.

Well, its all good, just happy to see you drawn out from behind the slogans and tossed into the Colosseum for a little battle with the plebes. 😆

Now that sounds like real fun!

The “principle” is subjective and therefore what it “really” is is defined by whoever controls the repository. If what you said were true, there would not be forks at all.

In POS there is no competition between the stake holders, which means essentially it's a private enterprise & utterly worthless.

its pretty nuanced

most POS coins have more validators than BSV.

its the rest of it thats messed up

I think his point is that they’re not really in competition, since they will constrain blocks so the least powerful validator can handle it. More sophisticated POS algos let stakeholders control this cutoff, but the validators still aren’t competing

POS systems try to direct MEV to stakeholders, while BSV tries to eliminate it altogether.

HATHOR is currently constraining BSV blocksize among other things

Most POS also have competition to be the next block producer, and costs to enter can be astornomically high too.
thats why im saying this is pretty nuanced

🤔

Agreed. Bitcoin is a PoW system, but it's in a PoS world.

No idea why miners getting all the fees is different from validators getting all the fees